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arferated - banned!
pansy
Posts: 1,445
Registered: 01-11-2005
0

Re: prop 8


oskibear wrote:

From LA Times:

 

70% of African Americans backed Prop. 8, exit poll finds
12:10 PM, November 5, 2008

A lot of Obama/Yes-on-8 voters? The Associated Press exit polls show that African Americans and Latinos backed Proposition 8 in good numbers. Details here from AP:

California's black and Latino voters, who turned out in droves for Barack Obama, also provided key support in favor of the state's same-sex marriage ban. Seven in 10 black voters backed a successful ballot measure to overturn the California Supreme Court's May decision allowing same-sex marriage, according to exit polls for The Associated Press.

More than half of Latino voters supported Proposition 8, while whites were split. Religious groups led the tightly organized campaign for the measure, and religious voters were decisive in getting it passed. Of the seven in 10 voters who described themselves as Christian, two-thirds backed the initiative. Married voters and voters with children strongly supported Proposition 8. Unmarried voters were heavily opposed.

 

 

Message Edited by oskibear on 11-05-2008 04:43 PM

 

 hispanics said no because of their catholic/religious backgrounds. we all know the man upstairs is gonna start hurling lightning bolts at everyone for letting gays get married. blacks said no because there's a cultural stigma against gays. men are supposed to be manly men and pimp women and have lots of kids. because the number of kids a black man has reflects positively on the man. and gays can't naturally have children.

 

ok maybe i didn't say that the right way but just pretend i did. i learned this from a book or journal or school or something.

"mark all as read" button... BRING IT BACK!!!

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Pansy - lvl 60 NE "warrior"

i must apologize in advance for any wipes i may cause
start running if i'm the last tank



THEpansy.
arf'er of Azzinoth
oskibear
Posts: 6,453
Registered: 02-17-2005
0

Re: prop 8

[ Edited ]

Interesting solution:

 

http://video.nytimes.com/video/2008/12/15/opinion/1194835653812/bloggingheads-ban-marriage.html
Take away the state/legal institution called "marriage" and call them all civil unions.   Churches can continue to do their religious marriages with civil unions (the legal status) tagging along.
Message Edited by oskibear on 12-16-2008 10:36 AM
____________________________________________
To succeed is to fail to fail.
oorah
Rhox
Posts: 6,789
Registered: 08-01-2005
0

Re: prop 8


oskibear wrote:

Interesting solution:

 

http://video.nytimes.com/video/2008/12/15/opinion/1194835653812/bloggingheads-ban-marriage.html
Take away the state/legal institution called "marriage" and call them all civil unions.   Churches can continue to do their religious marriages with civil unions (the legal status) tagging along.

Interesting indeed.  My two cents on this whole matter:

 

Marriage is a sacred religious ceremony that has been around for hundreds, if not thousands of years.  Most religions dictate how this ceremoy is to be performed under their specific religion.  Also under those religions, they dictated what is sinful and what is not permitted.  On Christianity, for example, homosexuality is a sin.  Allowing union of people in sin is not just a "no-no" but rather a huge slap in the proverbial face.  And in most cases, the religions ask that you be a member of their religion in order to be approved for marriage.

 

With that said, why do homosexuals want to be part of this religious ceremony called "marriage"?  Let the religions have their ceremonies.  Allow ALL the rights that a "marriage" has onto civil unions/domestic partnerships.  That way, everyone can have equal rights and be happy.

____________________________________________________________________________________
Rhoxx | Xyzr
I. Am. A. Special. Snowflake!
wtghaha
Posts: 3,819
Registered: 12-08-2004
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Re: prop 8

changing the name isn't going to solve anything. Homosexuals won't accept and it (they already have domenstic partnerships in california, but they still want to be 'married', ie. Prop 8) and the the religous side will still oppose it no matter what its called.

 

This is just one of those things where one side wants to make the other side miserable and vice versa, happens all the time, better to just not get involved.

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I. Am. A. Special. Snowflake!
Lautakwah
Posts: 4,641
Registered: 12-13-2004
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Re: prop 8

i propose outlawing marriage for straight people and making gay marriage legal.  r u kidding me thats the perfect setup.  honey i would love to marry you but its illegal! 
"Do you smeeeellll what the Rock is cooking?" THE ROCK.
oorah
Rhox
Posts: 6,789
Registered: 08-01-2005
0

Re: prop 8


wtghaha wrote:

changing the name isn't going to solve anything. Homosexuals won't accept and it (they already have domenstic partnerships in california, but they still want to be 'married', ie. Prop 8) and the the religous side will still oppose it no matter what its called.

 

This is just one of those things where one side wants to make the other side miserable and vice versa, happens all the time, better to just not get involved.


you sound like you know exactly what gay people want.. oh..

____________________________________________________________________________________
Rhoxx | Xyzr
I. Am. A. Special. Snowflake!
wtghaha
Posts: 3,819
Registered: 12-08-2004
0

Re: prop 8


Rhox wrote:

wtghaha wrote:

changing the name isn't going to solve anything. Homosexuals won't accept and it (they already have domenstic partnerships in california, but they still want to be 'married', ie. Prop 8) and the the religous side will still oppose it no matter what its called.

 

This is just one of those things where one side wants to make the other side miserable and vice versa, happens all the time, better to just not get involved.


you sound like you know exactly what gay people want.. oh..


 

yes...they want to be able to marry
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oorah
Rhox
Posts: 6,789
Registered: 08-01-2005
0

Re: prop 8


wtghaha wrote:

Rhox wrote:

wtghaha wrote:

changing the name isn't going to solve anything. Homosexuals won't accept and it (they already have domenstic partnerships in california, but they still want to be 'married', ie. Prop 8) and the the religous side will still oppose it no matter what its called.

 

This is just one of those things where one side wants to make the other side miserable and vice versa, happens all the time, better to just not get involved.


you sound like you know exactly what gay people want.. oh..


 

yes...they want to be able to marry

but but.. i'm taken~!

____________________________________________________________________________________
Rhoxx | Xyzr
I. Am. A. Special. Snowflake!
wtghaha
Posts: 3,819
Registered: 12-08-2004
0

Re: prop 8

who's the lucky man?

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oorah
Rhox
Posts: 6,789
Registered: 08-01-2005
0

Re: prop 8

i never kiss and tell... ::looks at Drak::
____________________________________________________________________________________
Rhoxx | Xyzr
Lorekeeper
Dracus
Posts: 12,329
Registered: 03-15-2005
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Re: prop 8


Rhox wrote:
i never kiss and tell... ::looks at Drak::
i don't date koreans

 

They call me Hadouken, cuz I'm down+right+fierce
arf'er of Azzinoth
oskibear
Posts: 6,453
Registered: 02-17-2005
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Re: prop 8


wtghaha wrote:

changing the name isn't going to solve anything. Homosexuals won't accept and it (they already have domenstic partnerships in california, but they still want to be 'married', ie. Prop 8) and the the religous side will still oppose it no matter what its called.

 

This is just one of those things where one side wants to make the other side miserable and vice versa, happens all the time, better to just not get involved.


The argument is that domestic partneships do NOT provide the all the same rights (alluded to in the link as 5-6 things that married people get that domestic partners don't).   Religious marriages are 2 distict entities, the religious sacrament/rite/ceremony/etc that is the purview the religious institution and not legally recognized, and the civil contract that the state recognizes.   This "solution" decouples the civil contract by using a different name for the civil part.   This should allow churches to continue to marry or not marry whomever they please while allowing everyone to get their state legal rights.

 

While I agree that each side wants to make the other miserable, I'll bet this play of semantics could make a 1-2% difference in the polls.

____________________________________________
To succeed is to fail to fail.
Thunderfury, Blessed Poster of arf
Kevorkian
Posts: 4,502
Registered: 12-10-2004
0

Re: prop 8

[ Edited ]

oskibear wrote:

wtghaha wrote:

changing the name isn't going to solve anything. Homosexuals won't accept and it (they already have domenstic partnerships in california, but they still want to be 'married', ie. Prop 8) and the the religous side will still oppose it no matter what its called.

 

This is just one of those things where one side wants to make the other side miserable and vice versa, happens all the time, better to just not get involved.


The argument is that domestic partneships do NOT provide the all the same rights (alluded to in the link as 5-6 things that married people get that domestic partners don't).   Religious marriages are 2 distict entities, the religious sacrament/rite/ceremony/etc that is the purview the religious institution and not legally recognized, and the civil contract that the state recognizes.   This "solution" decouples the civil contract by using a different name for the civil part.   This should allow churches to continue to marry or not marry whomever they please while allowing everyone to get their state legal rights.

 

While I agree that each side wants to make the other miserable, I'll bet this play of semantics could make a 1-2% difference in the polls.


 

 

Or we could just make up a lot of government budget shortfall by opening up taxation on all churches. This will give them the right to manipulate the American political process in a more open and transparent way than they have been doing, up to this point. I think a tax rate of 10% would be appropriately ironic.

Message Edited by Kevorkian on 12-16-2008 03:31 PM
I. Am. A. Special. Snowflake!
wtghaha
Posts: 3,819
Registered: 12-08-2004
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Re: prop 8

I have a feeling that most gays/lesbians don't want to get 'married' for those 5-6 minor differences between a domestic partnership and marriage. They want to be recognized as being 'married' in the social aspect of the word. This isn't a fight for a few minor rights that domestic partnerships don't grant (most probably don't even know of these minor differences).

 

Changing the word used in our laws isn't goiong to suddenly make everyone change the meaning or usage of the word. Heterosexuals will still use the term 'married' and homosexuals will want to be able to say the same thing, not 'Hi i'm civil unionized with this person'.

 

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